New Poll, Zenyatta vs Rachel Alexandra
Zenyatta after winning the Breeders’ Cup (Aint No Joke)
Having just watched Zenyatta remain perfect at 10-10 in her 5yo debut in the Milady, I’m sure I’m not the only one asking themselves “Zenyatta or Rachel Alexandra?”.
Are they our Personal Ensign and Winning Colors? Will their first meeting be in the Breeders’ Cup or will some track smartly try to draw a very marketable match-up, like say in the Jockey Club or Beldame or Mass Cap?
One thing’s for sure, whenever and wherever this match-up occurs, you really don’t want to miss it.
Zenyatta in the Milady:
Rachel in the Preakness:
In our last poll, GbG readers proved to be on the ball by overwhelmingly thinking that Mine That Bird’s chances in the Preakness were better than he was getting credit for. Although 4 of the 53 votes came after the Preakness. 18 of you thought he had no chance while 17 of you thought his chances where decent on an off track. Perhaps the smartest of all were the 6 brave souls who said they thought he was Triple Crown material… time will tell.
Posted by dana on May 23 2009
Filed Under: Zenyatta, Impressive, 2009, Rachel Alexandra, Rivalry, Poll, Fans, Race Replay, YouTube, Racing
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The matchup better be on dirt….or they might as well do it in the Turf Classic at Belmont (which would play the same as the Ladies Classic). Zenyatta can run on dirt. We want to see who the best dirt horse really is. That can’t be decided in California.
It’s also amazing that this horse doesn’t ship more to find longer races. She’s run 70 percent of her races at a mile and a 16th.
I agree re: dirt, Zenyatta’s no slouch on dirt + I seem to remember seeing somewhere that Shirreffs said it was her best surface (but can’t remember where).
I do wonder what’s up with the lack of shipping and generally not challenging her, maybe this is the Moss’s decision?
The JC and MassCap aren’t an option, because Shirreffs wouldn’t face colts. And I strongly doubt the Beldame, Shirreffs knows there’s the BC Distaff, where Zenyatta would face RA on a playing field tilted towards her interests.
If he wouldn’t even face inferior competition on a borderline off track, Shirreffs obviously doesn’t take any risk with this horse. Expect her to compete against minimal opposition on the West Coast until late October.
As I have just written on a Paulick Report comment: “the third place finisher, beaten only a couple of lenghts, was a horse I wouldn’t confidently back in an average European Listed race”. It might tell us something that I bet today’s third choice for 34/1 on betfair.
Jason and Dana,
If it ain’t broke…
SHIRREFFS and MOSS have had the good fortune to have ZENYATTA during this back-to-back SA Breeders’ Cups. They want to retire her undefeated.
That task will be a little more daunting with RACHEL in the picture, but with home court advantage it appears more likely than not to happen.
As for the shipping lament, when you own and train the champion, you run when and where you want to run. They tried to showcase her @ CD but the weather didn’t cooperate. That was the one and only time this year she’d have shipped out of California.
How terrible for horse racing had ZENYATTA won the Louisville Distaff on a good/sealed track but came away with a quarter crack a la 3y.o. big boy QUALITY ROAD after his wins on the GP pavement that substituted for a dirt track. The SHIRREFFS/MOSS way, we’re allowed to anticipate a ZENYATTA VS. RACHEL race.
As for the dirt question, unfortunately there is no reason for ZENYATTA to be shipped for the remainder of her career. She horrified her peers on a traditional main track in last year’s Apple Blossom…a field that included the defending BC Distaff winner GINGER PUNCH. ZENYATTA’s proven on dirt.
She’s answered every question thrown at her…RACHEL will be the final question on the track…then we’ll hold our breath while she tries to reproduce herself in the breeding shed.
AmCap - you’re so right, let’s just watch the magnificent Zenyatta go a 1 1/16th against Cali fillies for the rest of the year until the Breeders’ Cup. zzzzzzzzzzzzzzz.
A grab bag of things: Should we expect Jess Jackson to send Rachel A. to California for the BC after what happened to Curlin on that track? I don’t think so. And with that, the synthetic experiment should end in California. Beyond the surface uniformity the sport needs to foster its most compelling matchups, you can talk to the trainers out there about the supposedly safer surface. I asked Gary Stute about it when he was at Pimlico for the Preakness, and he said injuries from synth have cut his barn numbers in half. All sorts of things have cropped up that his horses never had in the past, like hind-end issues. The trainers out there don’t like it. He said this, not me…
I thought Zenyatta could have run at CD — the track looked fine by the seventh — but I can’t argue with such a fine trainer and person (who spent his youth in Port Washington!) as John Shirreffs. It’s his call. I do wish, however, he had come to Maryland to allow this brilliant beast to get a national showcase on the Preakness undercard. Even with its purse reduced, the Allaire DuPont Distaff is still a $150,000 GII — same as the Milady — and how many more people in the country would have seen her than they did yesterday? A lot. . .
I like comparing the prospects of Rachel Alexandra-Zenyatta to Personal Ensign-Winning Colors. Ideally, in fantasyland, you get a riveting stretch duel. Rachel A. would appear to have a tactical advantage — and she appears more tactical than Winning Colors was — but my lord, does Zenyatta have frightening acceleration.
Suggestion: Make it happen like it’s championship boxing. The Zenyatta people sit down with the Rachel Alexandra people and agree on a showcase showdown, either in an existing race or a created one. A mile and an eighth would probably be fair. Agree to run no mates, coupled or otherwise. Whoever else shows up, God bless ‘em.
Finally: Am I the only one who would love (have loved) to see Zenyatta run in the Metropolitan Handicap? The race looks made to order for her, and, to me, is the classic mile event in the country. This year’s edition, with the collapse of the handicap division (Oh, Hard Spun, what have they done to you?) is as bracing as a cup of tea made on the second use of the bag.
p.s. — If 1. Rachel Alexandra, 2. Zenyatta, 3. Winning Colors and 4. Personal Ensign met in a dream race, I’d play my triple like this: 4/3/1-2.
Shields up, John
Jess Jackson NOT send RA to CA for the BC???!! He’s a “SPORTSMAN”…ofcourse he will send her!
Zenyatta will look Rachel in the eye one time and Rachel will be finished. Zenyatta is a woman, Rachel is a little girl, end of story.
Yep, agreed dana! AND I love your reference to the Tea Bag! Also, VERY TRUE!!
Oops! SORRY, I meant to say I agreed with John S. Your LAST NAME isn’t SMITH, is it?
Dana,
Why can’t the owners of other runners be game enough to ship to Cali to take on the amazon??? All I ever hear from those not on the west coast is that the best Cali horses should ship to other tracks to be considered real champions or truly great.
Before it was “California tracks are too hard and fast.” Now the excuse is the synthetics. While I’m not completely sold on the plastics, they’re mandated and here to stay. Unless Keeneland does away with Polytrack, California will never see another dirt track at major race meetings.
I’m hearing on radio shows that ZENYATTA may take on the boys in the Hollywood Gold Cup, a race that EINSTEIN may also ship in for. Would that be enough to keep you awake?
I have also heard the Hollywood Gold Cup rumors. The older horse division lacks any serious competition in CA so I could see why they would consider running her in there. But if Einstein ships, I think they’d skip it and just run her in the Vanity on June 27. Moss and Shireffs are’t going to put her in against the boys just to get there name in the papers (like some others). They will wait until it really matters if they are ever going to run her against males. Dont see the point in running her in the Gold Cup unless the race comes up really light. Not that she couldn’t beat whoever was there, but why waste a big effort in July? October is the goal.
17-0 is a long ways away, but with the correct training and planning, not far fetched for this girl.
Einstein is hardly a reason to be scared to go to the Gold Cup. Great story and nice horse but not a horse that should be ducked. More importantly right now…let’s hope Renee Douglas comes out of his surgery in the best possible shape.
AmCap - it seems to me your first two paragraphs are actually directed at John S. as he’s the one who expressed the sentiment about synthetics and shipping in to Cali.
nature boy - do you think the only reason Jackson put RA in the Preakness was to get his name in the papers? Certainly he’s vain, but I think he correctly proved a very big point and I’m glad he did.
at this point keeping Zenyatta running in the Cali circuit against Cali fillies and mares is like only driving your Ferrari around the cul de sac. I didn’t have any gripes about the Milady because I thought it was smart to bring her back in (what was proved to be) a relatively easy spot. now that it’s been validated that “she’s still got it”, let’s see her challenged! I just find it hard to believe that any fan of racing would rather not see a champion challenged. did anyone feel that way about Curlin?
it doesn’t matter what racing fans want. It’s what the connections of the horse decide to do, in the best interest of the horse, and themselves.
Jason, I too do not think Einstein is a horse that should be ducked, but he’s no slouch, and she might have to work for it to beat thim.
John Shireffs is a conservative trainer which is a good thing.
Dana, I think ego played a bigger part in that filly running in that race than anything else. Her talent got her the win, nothing else. That race was not on her radar, she wasn’t trained up to it or anything of that nature. Mr. Wine Bottles decides he’s a sportsman and he is going to do what is best for the sport. great. Well why don’t you run her back in the Belmont if you care so much about the sport? i know- because she’s exausted and wont be up to running in it. Win or lose, running in the preakness was not what was best for that horse, or the triple crown. In the end, it was a setback for the animal. They could have waited and gave her a nice campaign for the rest of the year and then made a big move come Oct. but they wanted to be on racing’s biggest stage, all ego. Just my opinion.
If MTB wins the Belmont, watch how many horse racing fans start bitching about RA blowing the whole thing up. Her running in the preakness was good for the few days leading up to it, and the saturday it took place. Just my opinion.
Challenge doesn’t have to equate to not doing what’s right for the horse. Like I tried to state, he’s validated that she’s still in good form, and perhaps even her best form yet, why not challenge her?
Another way to look at the RA situation is that her previous owners denied us our Affirmed and Alydar by not having her on the Stallion Showcase trail.
Horse racing fans will bitch about anything. I saw some article bitching about fillies getting 5lbs. Take it to the bank that people will bitch if MTB wins the Belmont. I don’t really care if RA doesn’t run in the Belmont and MTB wins, because I think that if she would have been pointed to the TC, she would more than like be our TC winner. Tell me you think you shouldn’t have won the Derby.
The fact that she won the Preakness and it wasn’t even on her radar is even MORE impressive. Good for wine bottles, at least history will reflect what a truly great horse she is… let’s hope the same can be said for Zenyatta at the end her 2009 campaign.
Not looking to argue. Not denying she is a great horse, but the rest of the story is yet to be written. I happen to think it was a bad move to run her in that race. Dont get offended because I have a different opinion than you do.
If she couldn’t win the oaks, and the preakness, and then make it to the Belmont, then what suggests she could have won the derby, the preakness, and then the Belmont? That horse is spent right now, out of gas. She’s in no condition to run anytime soon.
I am not upset about her winning the preakness, not running in the belmont etc. i just dont buy alot of what people say.
I am curious to see how her running in the preakness and not in the Belmont or Acorn affects the attendance and TV ratings at the Belmont in 2 weeks. I would bet that it wont help. What is called “good for the sport” may be true for a weekend or two, but I cant see how it helps in the long run.
Zenyatta came off of a 7 month layoff, ran 1 1/16 miles. I dont see shireffs giving her another 7 weeks off to run her 1 1/4 miles against colts and horses. If he does, I am betting the house on her.
what makes you think I’m offended? I’m just expressing my opinion, just like you. sorry you took it that way!
LOL it’s all good baby doll. and honestly, I hope I am wrong about RA, I know she is great and would hate to see her career cut short because she was asked to do too much, too soon. I hope that isn’t the case at all. Be well. See you in a few weeks i hope.
yes, I hope you’re wrong too! :)
and indeed, see you soon! although my tickets haven’t arrived yet. I hope I didn’t wait to long to order them.
How can I not check back in with all this excellent barroom jabber going on?
First: Rachel Alexander was not good for racing or the Triple Crown or the horse? Did I read that correctly in here?
My response: You have got to be frigging kidding me.
Second: Zenyatta staying close to home? Didn’t John Shirreffs tip his conservative hand by scratching at Churchill Downs? He’s got the best female runner in the country and will do everything in his power to keep her undefeated and winning. Nothing wrong with wanting home cooking. I suggest anyone with a horse good enough to beat to head west for the challenge. For those of you wondering who that horse might be, might I lead you good people to the barn of Kiaran McLaughlin. Bring a mint and say hello to Seventh Street.
Third: Bet against Einstein at your own risk. In these diminished times, he is the best horse in the country. How many lengths would he have won the Met Mile by today?
Finally: Doesn’t anyone else think Summer Bird can beat Mine That Bird in the Belmont? Because I sure do.
correction: I meant to write:
Rachel Alexander WINNING THE PREAKNESS was not good for racing or the Triple Crown or the horse? Did I read that correctly in here?
I have to say I wasn’t expecting this much discussion!
Here’s an interesting anecdote that I just discovered. I have a google ad words campaign going. That means that I have purchased certain words and when they’re searched my ad displays.
I purchased “Rachel Alexandra” “Zenyatta” and ‘Mine That Bird”. Here’s how they break down by the number of impressions (meaning searches):
Rachel: 2920
Zenyatta: 661
Mine That Bird: 343
These numbers don’t represent total number of searches as I have a teeny budget but they’re proportional with the actual number of searches which means, generally speaking, that people are hella more interested in Rachel than Mine That Bird.
Zenyatta’s numbers being twice as high as Mine That Bird’s is very interesting. I have to think that there must be a decent amount of people erroneously searching for “Mind That Bird”.
And yes, I’m looking forward to seeing the other Bird in action at Belmont!
Update: just searched “Mind That Bird” and it resolves to “Mine That Bird” so I don’t think MTB’s low numbers relative to RA or Zenyatta can be explained by people searching incorrectly. I may have to do a post about this too!
Nice research, looks good. I like RA as much as anyone, and I was there on Oaks day and knew that I witnessed something very special. I don’t deny that she boosted interest in the sport and drew alot of attention. But, the question that remains to be answered is “At what cost?” We’ll find out as the year goes on when we see what is left of her. I happen to know that the Preakness took ALOT out of her. Hopefully she will bounce back. But, to me, if that race ends up compromising her future, it wasn’t worth it in any way; historically, financially, sensationally, none of it, ie Rags to Riches. One of the greatest races I have ever seen in the Belmont, but it is the race I beleive was the beginning of the end for her.
There was a reason Rachel Alexandra couldn’t pass Vet exams and did not qualify to go into the sales rings, she has physical issues. Probably why Hal Wiggins and her previous owners campaigned her the way they did. Those issues are still present. And I know she didn’t come out of the Preakness all that well…beyond media reports. That is why I feel the way I do, and think running her there was a costly mistake. Like i said before, I hope I am wrong.
I respect everybodys opinion,but let’s get to the real problem,racing wants to be recognized as a sport,sports needs stars,did kobe play 2 years and retire?,not,did lt play 4 years and retire?,not,did tom brady win a super bowl and retire?,not,the cycle sucks,ur sending perfectly sound horses to the breeding shed as soon as they make blacktype,horses are bred to be bred again not to race,who wins?owners and farms,the fans who bet,nada!,there should be a sanctioning body,your horse is sound,has run in graded stakes,said horse should be requored to run in at least 3 grade stakes the following year until age 5 barring serious injury,all u need is the right vets and ur off,until then we will watch dwindling attendance,get excited about rachel,then watch her dissapear,and wath these two duck each other and never face off,so sad
“run them in the Turf Classic at Belmont”?!! What are you, a complete idiot? A blind man could see that the two greatest dirt fillies(and probably two greatest dirt horses, PERIOD) have NO BUSINESS competing on grass! and all the bull over the fact that R.A. shouldn’t have to run against Zenyatta over California’s synthetic tracks-come on! The truth is, the synthetic surface issue is just a cover-up by Rachel Alexandra’s connections to make excuse for the fact that Rachel Alexandra is vastly inferior to Zenyatta on dirt OR synthetic. Zenyatta has beaten every a dozen grade 1 winners, is a grade 1 winner on dirt and synthetic, and recently beat a grade 1 winner in her first start in 8 months. Rachel Alexandra, by contrast, has ran a cupcake schedule and has beaten up on one of the weakest filly crops in history.Preakness winner? we all know better. She won the Preakness by the skin of her teeth, and if Mine That Bird had had another 10 yards he would’ve romped.
Jabat, I hope you’re being facetious. How is running in the Oaks and than running in the Preakness a cupcake schedule? Jess Jackson was widely criticized for running Rachel Alexandra back in the Preakness because of the difficulty of the schedule. Many analysts assumed that the Preakness would be detrimental to Rachel Alexandra. She proved herself better than her detractors and won. I’m sure any reasonable fan, or member of the industry itself, would agree that the Preakness was the toughest available choice for Rachel. No offense, but calling her schedule weak is the wrong side of ridiculous. Also, winning the Preakness by a full length, while on the lead, is not winning by the skin of her teethe. I’m sure she is a legitimate future rival for Mine That Bird.
On another note, arguing that Zenyatta is a better horse than Rachel Alexandra is a cheap shot. You’re comparing a fully evolved five year old to a developing three year old. If you want to reasonably compare their talents, wait until Rachel has faced older competition in the Fall. Arguing that Rachel is worse than Zenyatta, at this point, is like me arguing that Tim Tebow is worse than Tom Brady. The comparison is faulty.
I am surprised about all these comments regarding Zenyatta’s
lack of credentials as far as shipping somewhere else. Personal Ensign who is regarded as one of the greatest fillies of all time left only ONCE from her New York base. Just like Personal Ensign, anyone who wants to test Zenyatta knows where she is and where she is racing next. Why should the Eclipse Champion have to go out of her comfort zone. Last I heard the challenger is suppose to do that! Or everybody got caught up in the Rachel hype? :)
I find it amusing to see the rants of those that either know it all or know what is best for the horse or the horse racing industry. First off Rachel Alexandra is being compared to Ruffian and Secretariat at this particular time after her romp in the Mother Goose by almost 20 lengths being geared down the last 1/16th of a mile. Did any one watch that race, also looking at that race and the way that she finished up, does that give indication that Rachel was tired, or spent, or that the Preakness took too much out of her. Thats laughable. Someone mentioned that Zenyatta had beaten over a dozen Grade 1 winners. Its like wow either some people cant count or dont know the difference between allowance horses and Graded stakes winners, Zenyatta has beaten a number of Grade 1 placed stakes runners but the number of Grade 1 winners stands now at 8 possibly 9. She faced Ginger Punch, and then the crowd from the B.C. Ladies Classic. Therefore in 7 races Zenyatta faced 37 other mares of which 6 were grade 1 winners. This year she’s faced Life is Sweet so thats a total of 7. Please advise me of the other allowance or grade III horses that now have won Grade 1 events. Yeah i’ll wait because there arent any. I love hearing opinions even when they are wrong but lets try to post some facts. We do know one thing, Rachel Alexandra is something special and when you see a filly begin to turn colts and geldings towards a plan B, that’s saying something. She has their respect and they are paying attention to what she is doing. But its not only the boys that are taking notice, looking at the way that the connections of Acoma looked at running against R.A. gave indication that she has everyone’s attention. According to David Carroll he would run Acoma in the Delaware Handicap if the situation was right. He said: “If Rachel goes, we’re not going to run.” It says a lot when the connections of a 5 year old mare don’t want to run against a 3 year old filly. But this is not the first time this has happened if you recall this was the interview that Jerry Moss gave on 6.27.2009. Saturday morning, in an interview on the “Down the Stretch” radio show on Sirius XM radio, Jerry Moss, the owner of Zenyatta, said “there’s a good chance” Zenyatta would leave Southern California to race this year and that he “would very much like” to see his mare face Preakness winner Rachel Alexandra.
Moss said no decision on Zenyatta’s schedule would be made until after trainer John Shirreffs assesses how the mare comes out of Saturday’s Grade 1 Vanity Handicap at Hollywood Park.
Zenyatta scored her 11th victory in as many career starts in the Vanity. Rachel Alexandra posted her seventh straight victory with a romp in Saturday’s Grade 1 Mother Goose at Belmont Park.
“Obviously, we take it race to race,” Moss said. “[Shirreffs] is going to need a week to see how she’s come through this . . . then maybe we’ll say something about where our next start will be, and it could be out of the state for certain.”
“If the two horses are ready and at the top of their form, I would very much like to see a race between the two of them,” Moss said. This was before the running of the Mother Goose, then after seeing both horses run that day Mr. Moss came back on 6.28.2009, and changed his mind. Stating that the detention barns would cause Zenyatta problems just as it did Tiago and Giacomo. Is it really the detention barns that caused these two horses’ issues or the fact that they were not the highest quality of horse?
I would think that in Zenyatta’s case there would be no reason to worry about that due to her being undefeated and of such high quality stock. Hopefully we’ll see these two clash. That is still in the air, as for right now we have one horse working towards a Horse of the Year campaign and another horse working towards Horse of California Campaign, very similar to Lava Man. Scared to run against the horse that Broke Ruffian’s Record for lengths of victory and shattered the stakes record while being eased, yeah i would think so. To do a total 180 in 48 hours says something about how great Rachel Alexandra is. The connections of Zenyatta dont want to face her. Tooo bad for the sport.
I will be the first to admit as a huge Zenyatta fan that all you Rachel Alexandra people must be whooping it up right now after two mind-blowing performances in the Acorn and Haskell, but any objective thinker just CAN NOT get away from the fact that her owners are refusing to run her in this year’s Breeder’s Cup. What could it be, if not for the fact that Jackson & Co. are afraid 2 run against Zenyatta? Of course, Asmussen, et. al are using the thin excuse that they don’t want to risk her losing over a synthetic track–but R.A.’s already competed over the Polytrack at 2, and she won by 3 LENGTHS! Just something to think about. Oh, and why hasn’t anybody said anything about Zenyatta’s second powerful Vanity win? She didn’t win by nearly as much as R.A., but that’s her different running style which is to blame. What do y’all think?
wow, this comment thread is still going! thx everyone for stopping by and piping up. I’m a little alarmed what seems to be a bit of “either/or” in regards to being a Zenyatta OR a Rachel fan. I count myself as both (read my Zenyatta posts if you don’t believe me… I adore her).
I actually just published a post about this and Jake, I lifted a quote from your comment… I hope you don’t take it personally! it’s clear that you’re trying to invoke a discussion, the point I’m hoping to make is about the industry (and society in general), not about any individuals… everyone is entitled to their own opinions as far as I’m concerned!
carry on with your bad selves… :)
Too bad the connections of Rachel DO NOT want to face Zenyatta at the Breeders. I don’t blame them tough, they are probably right that Rachel has no chance against the big mare.
Dana, you are absolutely right! all the post on this thread is based on opinions except one.
RACHEL IS SKIPPING THE BREEDERS!
THAT’S NO OPINION AND THAT IS FACT!
What does that say. That says that Rachel’s camp don’t want to race the mare. That is fact not opinion.
Surface shouldn’t be a concern. It never has been with any connections in the Winners Circle when they win…it only seems to be with the losers.
The NFL is 50/50 with real and synths. I didn’t hear teams complain about the synth turf when they lost to New England.
Bottom line: People mock what they don’t understand. Hence JJ using “plastic” and complaining about the track versus tip his cap to the winning horse.
Rach is 3 zen is an older mare. Zenyatta has been babied her entire life and now she barely defeats avg. fillies and mares in california. Rach is taking on all challengers Zenyatta only her same sex rivals. Zenyatta is not a great horse as was Ruffian Personal ensign, Winning Colors and many more she has been protected her entire life and rach will defeat her if they are both at the top of their game. No contest on who is the more accomplished animal. Where was Zenyatta when she was 3 not in the preakness or travers. It is a mute point that people want to make more out of. I do not think Zenyatta will beat the best fillies in the world on dirt if her gutless trainer and owner would take her out of her crib. 13 races in how many years…case closed
The fact that Rachel is ducking the Breeders meant Rachel’s handlers are not confident Rachel can beat Zenyatta. All other speculations are fluff.
I believe that Jess Jackson is pointing a couple of his horses to the Breeders Cup. So, now he’s ok with Synth surfaces?
Weirdo.
If Zenyatta is a California horse then Personal Ensign is a New York horse. The truth is Zenyatta races in SA, Del Mar and Hollywood while Personal Ensign raced in Monmouth, Saratoga and Belmont. They both raced out of their comfort zone once. Zenyatta at Oaklawn and Personal Ensign at CD. In her last year of racing, top females avoided Personal Ensign and she basically run against a small field looking for 2nd place money, it’s just like how the top females are avoiding Zenyatta this year. Both have won the Breeders Distaff and Zenyatta could repeat. The only difference is that Personal Ensign beat 2 males in the Whitney in a 3 horse field. Those who are critizing the mare as just a California horse are ignorant of history. Of course, they now could say that the Grade 1 in California is not the same as the Grade 1 in the east coast. LOL
no one know for sure who is the better lady. but one we all knew rachel left summer bird standing, zenyatta pass summerbird in the last 100yards so until then its a tuff called but i gives rachel the edge for beating the boys twice and horses once zenyatta needs to start beat fields like the breeders cup no more five and six horse field or should i say allowance field